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prestige class question

Discussion in 'Pathfinder' started by Kendo, Dec 29, 2016.

?

How many dice would the fireball be?

Poll closed Jan 5, 2017.
  1. eight, unless something funky was going on

    100.0%
  2. five, unless something really funky was going on

    0 vote(s)
    0.0%
  3. something else

    0 vote(s)
    0.0%
  1. Kendo

    Kendo New Member

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    If I had a wizard (5) turned soul warden (3) and the soul warden, on paper, looks like he could cast the same spells as a level 8 wizard, could he cast a level 8 fireball? Can you give me a link showing the answer?

    Thanks
     
  2. Josh Scott

    Josh Scott New Member

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    "+1 level of existing spellcasting class"
     
  3. Kendo

    Kendo New Member

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    True, that was found on the page on Soul Warden, and it is strongly supportive of both your and my positions (for I do agree with you).On the label at the head of that column, however, it reads, "Spells per Day." That doesn't take all the starch out of our argument, but it does make it a lot more ambiguous.

    In a paragraph below, it reads, "He does not, however, gain other benefits a character of that class would have gained, except for additional spells per day, spells known (if he's a spontaneous caster), and an increased effective level of spellcasting. If he had more than one divine spellcasting class before becoming a soul warden, he must decide to which class he adds the new level for the purpose of determining spells per day." I do not believe this to be definitive in the other direction, either.

    Kendo
     
  4. Josh Scott

    Josh Scott New Member

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    To me, this phrasing clears it up, "... , except for additional spells per day, spells known (if he's a spontaneous caster), and an increased effective level of spellcasting."
     
    Kendo likes this.
  5. Kendo

    Kendo New Member

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    Turning my own words aganst me? Well done and thanks for ably pointing out what had eluded me.
     
  6. owlbear

    owlbear Administrator
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    I've been dealing with this topic a lot lately and yes, "+1 level of existing spellcasting class" features should do exactly that. A wizard level 6 + prestige class which adds +2 level of spellcasting class could cast an 8d6 fireball.

    While a level 6 wizard who took 2 levels in another class or a prestige class without +1 level of existing spellcasting class features, would only cast a 6d6 fireball, even if both classes have fireball as a spell.

    Examples that I got from WotC were things like a 6th level wizard / 6th level sorcerer casting a fireball would either cast from the wizard list at 6th level or the sorcerer list at 6th level.

    We have added in support to the Feature Library to handle prestige classes that stack levels as well as general "stacking" rules for house ruled games which allow classes to stack levels.

    Below is an image from the soon-to-release feature library configuration of a 3.5/Pathfinder fireball:

    upload_2016-12-31_15-48-27.png

    The multiply effect node holds the stacking and variable dice rules. In this case we've selected "All" for the classes, this is because that's the easiest to test with on our end.

    A production version of the spell would have only spellcasting classes who get Fireball as the selected classes. Again, this logic is still being worked on, so it'll get refined further for handling prestige classes and such.

    Additionally, we've been working on prestige classes and class variants so you'll actually be able to specify a prestige class for a character or a variant of a class.

    upload_2016-12-31_15-52-50.png

    Double clicking on this field will present a list of variant classes which are available to Wizard and allow you to add it to your character. We're still working on testing this system as a mechanism to handle prestige classes and may opt to keep them on a second line as tracking level in a prestige class separately is very helpful -- either way, "we're working on this problem" is the short answer I was attempting to offer!
     
  7. Josh Scott

    Josh Scott New Member

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    This is fantastic! Great work!
    I can't tell if there will be a way to modify Caster Level per event. Specifically based on a roll ... Wild Mage style: [(-3 + [d6]) casterLevel] per event
     
  8. owlbear

    owlbear Administrator
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    There will be. We're working on logic to handle variable caster/spell level while still leaving the feature with a default value set in the currently-unnamed level node (in the fireball example, it's the value node with a 3 in it).

    I have a solution that works for 5e but I want a variable solution that works for any system. Honestly, if we were just building for a single game system, we'd have been done a long time ago :)
     
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  9. Kendo

    Kendo New Member

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    That's a good solution and will probably work for everybody at least most of the time. I have to wonder if there isn't some player in some system somewhere (*whistles innocently*) who might have two prestige classes that modify a base class. Mightn't it be at least equally good to RCLICK on the class modified by the prestige class, select the prestige class from possible prestige classes and just add the prestige class(es) as indented rows under the base class?

    You're definitely headed in the right direction, though.

    Kendo
     
  10. owlbear

    owlbear Administrator
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    So the way the prestige classes will work is slightly different than the variant bit I detailed above.

    You'll still be able to take a prestige class (or several) through the normal -- add a class -- mechanic. The difference is that a prestige class will have classes they can augment listed in their descriptions.

    In other words, this solution should work for you just fine :)

    The real magic sauce comes from the features define for traits. These are were we'll get solid blending between classes and prestige classes.

    I'm currently working on a new AC mechanic which is holding up some other work, so I had to take a break from prestige and variants. Hopefully I'll be back on task for this topic in the next week though!
     
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