1. This site uses cookies. By continuing to use this site, you are agreeing to our use of cookies. Learn More.
  2. While the majority of active discourse on D20PRO has moved to our Discord Channels, this forum is still active and checked-in on regularly by our staff. However, for the very latest information, conversation and/or immediate support, please join us on Discord here: http://discord.gg/Ph38ckM
    Dismiss Notice

Pathfinder Adventure Path

Discussion in 'General Discussion' started by ampherion, Jan 26, 2011.

  1. ampherion

    ampherion New Member

    Joined:
    Jan 26, 2011
    Messages:
    5
    Likes Received:
    0
    I am considering starting a virtual campaign based on one of the Pathfinder Adventure Paths. I want to get an order of magnitude idea of what kind of work it will be to enter all encounter areas, maps, npcs, and traps into d20pro to assist in running the sessions. I am assuming I would buy all pathfinder datasets to save myself data entry time. I do have all of the PDF and print materials for any adventure path I might want to run.

    How long would it take to setup a combat encounter with a small number of beastiary foes?
    How about if I add an npc?
    Are traps and custom magic items and spells hard to model? I am assuming that those things that are in the AP but not part of the actual RPG won't be done.

    I was hoping to build up maybe a quarter to half of the material from each AP book beforehand.

    I just want to know what I am committing to up front.

    Thanks for your help!
    Amp
     
  2. edwardcd

    edwardcd Administrator
    Staff Member

    Joined:
    Oct 13, 2010
    Messages:
    1,374
    Likes Received:
    9
    Hi Ampherion,

    That's a lot of questions! :) So, I guess I'll break them down into their parts and if you have any follow-up questions please ask.

    Creating Maps

    Option 1: Look for community created map files specific to the Adventure Path and download them. You can find a listing on Pazio.com under messageboards, or perhaps another mapmaking website such as dundjinni map forums or profantasy software library or rpg map share or cartographer's guild forums.

    Option 2: Open the Adventure Path PDF and take a snapshot of the map. Paste that into your graphic editing software (such as paint (free), gimp (free), photoshop (not free), or etc). Save as PNG or JPG.

    Option 3: Create a map from scratch using a graphic editing program (as described above), or a map drawing software such as Campaign Cartographer or Dundjinni. Save as PNG or JPG.

    Option 3: Use the draw tools in d20Pro to draw out the building walls and doors, color if wanted.

    Option 4: Draw your map by hand using graph paper and scan when finished. Save as PNG or JPG.

    Regardless of the option you picked to create a map file on d20Pro (unless you created it directly inside d20Pro)....
    Open d20Pro as Judge, goto d20Pro Menu and select Library, press on the Map Library section, press Import, press From File, and select the PNG or JPG file you saved. Then align the grid by adjusting the position of the image and/or resizing the pixels of the grid.

    Depending if there is existing community created maps or if you want to create your own will determine the time you dedicate to this process. It could range from a couple minutes per map and upward depending on your familiarity of the map making software you use.


    Creating Enemies for Encounters
    Using the Pathfinder Bestiary that our community member bigkilla created will make any encounter with any enemy listed in the bestiary very easy. You can view and download from this forum topic. You can also clone any monster and modify the clone to be of higher level or add any flavor you wish to any monster you wish simply by editing the creature's character sheet.

    IF you need specific named NM or enemy, you can simply create one from scratch by creating a new creature, assigning stats, saves, hp, attacks, special abilities, etc. This process may take you a few minutes per creature, but after you get the hang of it you'll realize that this is pretty easy as you can copy-paste all the info from the PDF into the notes section, and simply just complete three or four tabs (general, attack, ability, and sometime spell). I usually spend about 2 - 5 minutes programming different bad-guy types to be completely automated when they are in battle with my PCs, and have approximately 4 differing types. This time spent here will greatly speed up combat, in which d20Pro really shines!


    Creating Encounters
    Once you have all your battlemaps and enemies/NPCs and Players entered in d20Pro, the "hard work" is done!
    Next, you can open a map from your Map Library, then drag creatures (PCs/NPCs/Enemies) from your Creature Library right on the map and you can position them as you wish. You can select enemies and make them invisible until the time is right, and can cover the non-explored parts of the map with a fog-of-war. This is also another place where d20Pro really shines, the simplicity of adding creatures to the map!

    I just completed converting a Pathfinder Society Adventure into d20Pro and it took me about an hour to prep (skim-read adventure, copied all but one map on the PDF - one map I created in Campaign Cartographer, saved them, imported PNG file, created the several types of enemies and NPCs, and put them all together). This one hour for me to prep will occupy about 3-4 hours of play time with 4-7 players.


    Traps and custom magic items are pretty easy to model and implement. For traps, I simply create a character, name it appropriately, and set it to invisible so the players do not see where it is. Once one of the Player's set off the trap I use the Trap Character Ability (whatever the trap may be) and apply the effect to the affected Players. This would be stored in the "Ability" tab including the effect, dc, and number rounds affected.

    For custom magic items, I would create the effect in the "Ability" tab of the character who has said magic item. Simply use the "Charge" descriptor and indicate how many charges that magic item has, or if it recharges every day, use the "Per Day" amount. Simply select the effect from the effect window and save.

    Spells currently have their own database that each Judge (DM/GM) has to create (at this time). Once you have created your spell database (which does not save DC's OR Duration) you can quickly select the effect that the Player wants to use when they cast a spell. Alternatively, you could use the "Ability" Tab to set spell effects and the number of each spell per day which would save DC's and duration.


    If you have any questions, or unable to follow using d20Pro let me know and I can quickly whip up a step-by-step guide with screenshots to help explain. :)
     
  3. Daeruin

    Daeruin New Member

    Joined:
    Dec 24, 2010
    Messages:
    251
    Likes Received:
    1
    Curtis, with all the lengthy and detailed replies you post here on the forums, maybe you should consider just "whipping up" a complete user's guide or a wiki! Or maybe an advanced user's guide that gets into more detail than the official online manual. :)
     
  4. ampherion

    ampherion New Member

    Joined:
    Jan 26, 2011
    Messages:
    5
    Likes Received:
    0
    Curtis,

    Thank you very much for your verbose reply. I think what you have explained will get me where I need to go until I actually start doing the work itself.

    I will be using graphics lifted from the PDFs for the campaign, the only thing I need to worry about is that there may be map items that I have to remove (traps, secrets, numbers) as the adventure path graphics never remove these. It could prove to be a problem since I'm graphically challenged. I could just sketch the stuff on graph paper which would give the players a "self-made" feel, but it really will look sad to have a program with great color depth with a white map... I will check for community created maps first just to save some time.

    I previously activated a license of d20pro to play in a campaign as a player...but I never used the judge capabilities, so I may just have to jump in.

    I am really happy to hear that your preptime for an adventure was 1 hour. Mine will be longer, of course, due to my lack of experience, and because I will probably have every single picture in the AP as a handout or some other graphic for the game, not to mention token wrangling, but even at 2 or 3 hours per, its not bad at all. I figure, with an estimate of 5 hours per book in the AP, its ~30 hours of prep for the entire AP which will be running for a LONG LONG time. Several months I am guessing...

    Oh, and before I forget...did you create your entities in herolab, or just build them straight into d20pro?
     
  5. edwardcd

    edwardcd Administrator
    Staff Member

    Joined:
    Oct 13, 2010
    Messages:
    1,374
    Likes Received:
    9
    Typically I use herolab for major NPCs and boss-type bad guys then refine them in d20Pro. For any minion-type bad guy I simply enter the nuts and bolts into d20Pro's character creator and use a simple image from either Devin Night's free token collection or from wizards gallery or from 3.5 OGL gallery or from a simple google image search.

    I'm sure your prep time will lower each time you convert an Adventure Path Volume into d20Pro as you'll become more proficient with the software.

    Perhaps... Since most guides start from questions asked... What details would you be interested to know more about d20Pro? Or, what topic on d20Pro's Online Manual do you think needs more content or in-depth look? Or, were you thinking that each topic on d20Pro's Online Manual could have an "advanced" section?
     
  6. neofax

    neofax New Member

    Joined:
    Apr 24, 2010
    Messages:
    123
    Likes Received:
    0
    Why take a snapshot of the map in the PDF when you can rip the map out minus all of the DM info? You can do this either by using SomePDF Extractor or downgrading Adobat Acrobat Reader to version 8(I do not recommend this as it is very susceptible to hacks). Once you have each map saved as a jpg or png, then use GIMP and the Excel file called mapscaletool over on the RPTools.net forums site. This will allow you to match the grid to a pixel size. I personally use 50pixels. If you need help with this, let me know at neofax99 <AT> gmail dot com. I can make pretty much any Paizo AP map be dead on where the grid inside d20Pro is not necessary using this method.
     
  7. edwardcd

    edwardcd Administrator
    Staff Member

    Joined:
    Oct 13, 2010
    Messages:
    1,374
    Likes Received:
    9
    wow... just wow, this makes it a whole lot easier! Spent 1 minute to download, install, open file, pressed the "Play" style button and bam! all images are nicely extracted to a folder without GM notes on it. Very good suggestion!

    http://www.somepdf.com/downloads.html

    Direct Link
    http://www.beauvais1.com/mapscaletool/
     
  8. neofax

    neofax New Member

    Joined:
    Apr 24, 2010
    Messages:
    123
    Likes Received:
    0
    Some PDF's though are jacked and may be easier to use the Adobe Acrobat Reader 8(security risk alert!) to retrieve the pics. Kingmaker I know is one of them with black blotches around some of the bad guys images. Since I am anal about my pics having a transparent background, it can be a PITA to get them right. Glad those helped!
     
  9. ampherion

    ampherion New Member

    Joined:
    Jan 26, 2011
    Messages:
    5
    Likes Received:
    0
    I also noticed that some of the imagery is a little hosed using SomePDF Image Extractor, but I'm not sure its bad enough for me to worry.

    What I am surprised about is that the actual PDF imagery of maps (in this case I was using Kingmaker 6 maps as a test) are really not great to work with. Its hard to count the squares since they are so blurry, and only 96dpi :(

    Either way, I bought d20pro so I can play with it...

    Thanks very much for hooking me into the information, it will prove to be invaluable.
     
  10. Golkiwu

    Golkiwu Member

    Joined:
    Sep 7, 2010
    Messages:
    365
    Likes Received:
    5
    I found this an issue myself. I now render all my maps in Dundjinni, and import them to D20PRO. It is time consuming, but the maps look great even close up. I tried the Somepdf, and it did some strange things to the images, like black boxes around any text. Unfortunately the Dundjinni store is down due to site migration issues, and "may" be up "soon". Campaign Cartographer is good too, but it is very Auto Cad like, and therefore a pain for me to learn.
     
  11. ampherion

    ampherion New Member

    Joined:
    Jan 26, 2011
    Messages:
    5
    Likes Received:
    0
    How much trouble do you have recreating the maps with Dundjini? Do you have to substitute for different imagery?
     
  12. Golkiwu

    Golkiwu Member

    Joined:
    Sep 7, 2010
    Messages:
    365
    Likes Received:
    5
    It is time consuming, and I have spent a lot of time gathering tiles and object sets. I find that it is variable as to the substitution issue. Most times I have no problem finding a match for the map items, but on occasion I do have to get extremely creative to render what is in the OG map. The Shadow Clock was one, where there were a million sets of stairs, and large bells. I had to use a bit of artistic license on that one. I feel that the maps, while important to keep some integrity from the original, are still yours to change and adapt. The players won't even know what is different if you have to change something. I embellished a bit on the Sevens Sawmill water wheel, and I feel it looks good and keeps the flavor of the original map. I enjoy the ease Dundjinni affords to map creation. I do wish there were better tools to import them into D20pro for large scale maps. I had to create 6 different maps for the Stone Hold Mountain maps due to the original's 1"=10' scale. I want it to be one big map, but dundjinni only affords one size for the largest map it can create (that I am aware of). I have failed in my attempts to move them on tho a Large map on D20pro. I am unsure if it is my ignorance of how, or if it is not supported in the way I want to do it. I personally wish the D20pro map tools were as intuitive as Dundjinni, but that is not a critical issue for me. It would be nice to see a more detailed How-To for this and many other parts of this software (wink wink, nudge nudge, know what I mean....) as I find the current version too condensed.
     
  13. ampherion

    ampherion New Member

    Joined:
    Jan 26, 2011
    Messages:
    5
    Likes Received:
    0
    I'm so artistically challenged people have trouble figuring out what my stick figures and flow charts represent. If it requires art at all, its a bust.

    I do have CC3 (and CC2), but I gave up using them years ago. I can do it from a CAD perspective, but I guess I'm really way too type A. It looks like dundjinni used to have a picture of the week which would have been cool to just collect over time, but it appears its been 4 years since the last update. I do know there are lots of user/community based art projects out there that have quite a bit of activity, but its so time consuming to get through...I need to figure out what my parameters are and then pull the trigger.

    We are going to be running either Legacy of Fire or Kingmaker, I just need one more pass through the userbase to call it.
     
  14. Golkiwu

    Golkiwu Member

    Joined:
    Sep 7, 2010
    Messages:
    365
    Likes Received:
    5
    You need to troll their forum. Their is a link there for their monthly archives that are up to date.

    Here is one for direct folder download - http://www.box.net/shared/ljb15vae1b or here might be newer http://www.wuala.com/Peregrin/Mapping/Dundjinni Forums Monthly Archives

    and here is one that is browse-able - http://www.halerecordings.com/gaming/gallery/main.php?g2_itemId=2468

    I got almost all of my newer tiles at the last one.

    Just do a search on the Dundjinni forums for "Objects" or "Tiles" or whatever you are looking for ("Gore" etc.).

    Stuff is out there. :twisted:
     
  15. UndeadDan

    UndeadDan Member

    Joined:
    Apr 5, 2010
    Messages:
    32
    Likes Received:
    0
    If you don't want to do screenshots and you don't want to re-create in Dundjinni (or can't because you got a new computer and their store has been down for months so you can't get the activation codes for the software. GRRRRRRRRRRR!) if you use Adobe reader you can just select the images and cut and paste them directly into GIMP.

    I also cannot express how much Hero Lab helps expedite the process, especially if you are updating one of the old D20/3.5 paths to PFRPG.
     
  16. Golkiwu

    Golkiwu Member

    Joined:
    Sep 7, 2010
    Messages:
    365
    Likes Received:
    5
    Yes, it is unfortunate that their site mitigation is taking for-ever.

    I personally would like to see D20PRO buy out the rights to Dundjinni and integrate it to replace their current map functions, which I find awful.

    Java anyone? :D
     
  17. Arbarth

    Arbarth New Member

    Joined:
    Mar 27, 2011
    Messages:
    8
    Likes Received:
    0
    So after reading all the posts so far - I can "copy maps" from PDF's but is their a way built into d20Pro to cover over things like numbers or letters - so it does not look like *&^$ ? If so please explain the process.

    This would help ALOT.

    Thanks,
    Arbarth
    Old School GM
     
  18. Golkiwu

    Golkiwu Member

    Joined:
    Sep 7, 2010
    Messages:
    365
    Likes Received:
    5
    I believe that you are supposed to "Clean Up" the PDF prior to your importing it. I am unsure if this is native to any of the free extraction software. When I used SomePDF, I had a lot of black backgrounds under the map lettering, which did look like hooey. Maybe someone has a better way and may post it. Now I will say that windows 7 has a cutting tool that is quite useful in retrieving images from PDF or anything for that matter. It does not get rid of the pre-printed letters/wording, but I got a very useable image. I imagine there must be simple paint program that could copy/sample near by areas for use in covering over the lettering and keeping it looking good.
     
  19. Zandari

    Zandari New Member

    Joined:
    Sep 12, 2010
    Messages:
    46
    Likes Received:
    0
    If you have legal copies of the pdf files for the Adventure Paths, most of them are layered, so that if you use an image extraction program (like Adobe Acrobat, SomePDF, etc.) and select the artwork, it will not select the text, because that is a layer above the artwork in the pdf. I have actually spoken to the folks at Paizo about this, and they said they do that on purpose, because they know we like to pull their maps and use them in VTTs.

    Genius!
     
  20. Arbarth

    Arbarth New Member

    Joined:
    Mar 27, 2011
    Messages:
    8
    Likes Received:
    0
    Thanks for the Info - if that works it will save time preping thinks - I will try it sometime today and post how it goes on here.

    Thanks again :D
     

Share This Page