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can't figure out to do spell/combat effects

Discussion in 'General Discussion' started by PenCapChew, Jan 9, 2013.

  1. PenCapChew

    PenCapChew New Member

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    As the title suggests, I can't seem to figure out how to enforce spell/combat effects in regards to 4e. I have read the online manual and particularly this section: http://www.d20pro.com/help/UGPlayManEffects.php. A while ago I posted a similar question here in this thread: viewtopic.php?f=2&t=1141 and tried those suggestions to no avail. I have clicked on on the effect white box that says "inert" and have seen a slew of tabs such as save, skill, HP, desc, notes, attack, ability, and AC. Even after messing around I still can't get effects to work properly. If someone could post screenshots of special abilities of say, "Flaming Sphere",(it's a conjuration effect that can be moved by the wizard, I can't seem to figure out how to make a "conjuration effect" that can be moved around. I also later noticed by hitting ctrl E I pull up the active effects window but I am not sure how this ties into spell effects. Does it allow the DM to auto track effects such as stun or daze and auto roll for saving throws?

    Another example would be fighter's cleave, or any ability that lasts till that person's next turn as I can't seem to find the entry for "until next turn".

    Also I can't seem to get daily, encounter, and healing surges to not be available in the PC's attack options even after editing them in the ability section to say "0/1". Lastly, I noticed that the spell "Thunderwave" has multiple numbers to hit as indicated in this screenshot: download/file.php?id=60&mode=view and I cannot seem to duplicate this. I love this product but I must admit this portion is quite frustrating. Any help is appreciated.
     
  2. edwardcd

    edwardcd Administrator
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    Flaming Sphere

    Here is a quick tutorial for you regarding 4E. (at least how I would do it - there are other ways of course)

    The Setup! It's Akashik vs a Zombie and Akashik has won the initiative!
    [​IMG]

    Akashik uses Map Markers with the blue pointer and a custom name on the lower label and places it as the Player says "I want to use a daily power Flaming Sphere right here."
    [​IMG]

    Akashik opens his Mini Character, and under the Abilities Tab he selects "Flaming Sphere"
    [​IMG]

    The Player selects "click to target"
    [​IMG]

    The Player selects his character "Akashik Gruntilda"
    [​IMG]

    The Player presses "OK" to approve the target selection.
    [​IMG]

    The Player presses "OK" to send the ability use to the Judge/GM/DM.
    [​IMG]

    The Judge/GM/DM goes into their Creature Library and drags out a Flaming Sphere to represent map placement.
    Note: Judge can assign the Player ownership of the Flaming Sphere so they can move it as they wish.
    [​IMG]

    This is the new map setup with the placed Flaming Sphere.
    [​IMG]

    The Player uses their Attack called "(D)Flaming Sphere(s,r10)" then presses "OK"
    Note: naming scheme used is my personal naming scheme to instantly know what the attack represents.
    • (D) = Daily Power
    • s = standard action
    • r = range
    • can you guess what "(E)" or "b" means?
    [​IMG]

    Player selects the target adjacent to the Flaming Sphere as the Power dictates.
    [​IMG]

    Judge reviews the attack and resolves. In this case this is a successful hit.
    [​IMG]

    Judge reviews the damage and resolves. In this case this hit deals 10 fire damage.
    [​IMG]

    Player ends their turn. (Player can press the spacebar or use the "End turn" button.)
    [​IMG]

    Judge approves effect after player ends their turn. This will allow the effect to stay until the end of Akashik's next turn.
    [​IMG]

    Akashik's Mini Effects Tab (the saved description of the effect I typed into the Description Tab of the Ability so it can be displayed on the character like it does in the picture).
    inert = This effect does not affect this creature in any way, it is simply a marker to denote the description.
    [​IMG]

    All effects that are active will be inside this Active Effects Window. You can cancel any active effect by pressing the "x" in this window, or on the effects tab of the creature's mini character sheet/window.
    • By pressing the top "x" that will cancel that effect for all creatures it is affecting.
    • By pressing the "x" besides the creature's name will cancel that effect for that individual creature.
    [​IMG]
     
  3. edwardcd

    edwardcd Administrator
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    Cleave
    (my way - of course there are other ways)

    Current Map Staging. Cedric is now up in initiative.
    [​IMG]

    Player attacks using Cedric Chester and elects to use the Cleave At-Will ability. The Player will select both lines "(W)Cleave - Primary Target" and "(W)Cleave - Secondary Target" then press "OK."
    [​IMG]

    Player selects the Primary Target for the At-Will ability "Cleave."
    [​IMG]

    Player selects the Secondary Target for the At-Will ability "Cleave."
    [​IMG]

    Judge/GM/DM reviews the "Primary Target" attack and resolves. In this case it is a hit.
    [​IMG]

    Judge reviews and approves the damage. In this case it is 13 damage.
    [​IMG]

    If the Primary Target was hit the Judge selects "hit" in this resolve attack window regardless of the attack roll.
    [​IMG]

    The Judge reviews and resolves the damage.
    [​IMG]
     
  4. edwardcd

    edwardcd Administrator
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    Thunderwave Question

    Multiple attacks on the same attack line
    http://www.d20pro.com/help/UGGPCreatures.php - Read under the heading "The Attack Tab."

    Basically:
    Multiple lines of the same exact attack
    [​IMG]
    Yeild multiple attacks on the same line.
    [​IMG]
    Note: only the "To Hit" value can change to keep the multiples grouped together on the same line.
     
  5. edwardcd

    edwardcd Administrator
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    When you edit the ability to "0/1" for any per day or per init, the ability is still listed in the Abilities Tab. However, the Player can no longer select that line (as long as you have refreshed the game state to your players after editing).

    If you are talking about Encounter, Utility, or Daily Powers that have a physical attack listed as an Attack in the character's Attack Tab. There is no way to remove that from their Attack list (unless you simply want to delete the attack line - which would be quite the process to re-add after it recharges). Remember d20Pro is simply a tool and does not enforce all game mechanic rules. Have your players watch their Character's Mini Character Sheet Abilities Tab to keep track of what they have used to make appropriate attack options. Also have the Players use the ability inside the Abilities Tab to help themselves keep track of what they have used - if the "ability" or power does not have a spell-like effect or any description there is no need to select a target - just click the power in the abilities tab then press "OK" twice quickly.
     
  6. PenCapChew

    PenCapChew New Member

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    Thank you Edwardcd for taking the time with screenshots. Unfortunately I still can't duplicate in its entirety what you did for the spell example of Flaming Sphere. Here are my issues:

    1) I can't create a map marker, let alone a pointer. When I go to game tools and select map markers, nothing is listed. No matter what I try as suggested by the black Map marker box text, the create button is greyed out at the bottom of the window.

    2) While following your steps for the spell effect, I noticed you have the words "inert, 1 round" in your EFFECT box for the special ability window. Why did you choose this? Flaming sphere has an option of sustaining the whole encounter if the PC chooses to do so. I am not sure why you picked 1 round. In fact I haven't seen many abilities in 4e yet that say they last "x" amount of rounds. It is usually to the "end OR start of that player or monster's turn" and typically has a saving throw accompanied with it. Is there a way to have d20 pro make an auto saving throw with applicable bonuses to see if a status effect ends? NOTE: most of these particular issues I can personally track on paper but I would like to do as little tracking as possible to focus on the story and unexpected decisions by the PC's, hence my troubles with the system in regards to spell effects.

    3) After copying your written text for the effect box (inert; 1 round), I selected the PC character as the target. This causes the PC character to have an icon of a white star with a blue halo tint to appear in the upper left hand corner of the PC token. I didn't see this occur in your screenshot example. Am I doing something incorrectly? I noticed if I hit ctrl-E to bring up the active effects window I could see my PC character listed. By clicking the "x", the white star with the blue halo had disappeared from my PC token.

    4) I went ahead and place a flaming sphere token and made an attack with the PC wizard. Damage is properly applied but the white star w/ a blue halo still remains on the PC character afterwards. I am assuming that white star/blue halo object will remain on the PC character until the end of that PC's turn, correct? If that is true, is there a way in d20 pro to have an effect end on the START of a player/monster's turn?

    5) I noticed towards the bottom of your post you had spell information in the "effects tab" of Akashik's mini. How did you enter that information?

    As a side note, I really like your notation for Encounter, Daily, ranged and burst.
     
  7. edwardcd

    edwardcd Administrator
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    First off, I'm using the most recent release candidate version 3.3 (which has more features/functions). You can pickup that version from our beta forums: http://forums.d20pro.com/viewtopic.php?f=29&t=2032

    Next, the new way to place Map Markers is to first get into the Map Marker Mode by opening up Map Markers Window. Then, click anywhere on the map (map or outside of the map is ok) then select "Create Marker"
    [​IMG]
    [​IMG]
    [​IMG]
    [​IMG]
    [​IMG]
    [​IMG]

    Start of next turn = 1 round and approve effect/ability on character's turn.
    End of next turn = 1 round and approve effect/ability after character's turn.
    - - - Note: rounds are determined from when the effect is applied. This is more of a D&D3.x/PFRPG reference.
    Inert = no bonus or penalty applied to this creature.

    Flaming sphere only lasts until the end of the character's next turn unless they choose to sustain it as a minor action. So, true... it could last the entire combat. Though, I think players are smart enough to keep track of it themselves... just like in a face to face game - as long as their flame sphere is on the table they are not going to forget about it.

    I'm not sure what you mean by "saving throw" since in my understanding of 4E is that these attacks are based off a static defense. If you can expand on that and give me an example, I can surely work with a complete description.

    This is noting that there is an active effect on this creature. This is suppose to happen. You can take a look at my Mini Window (mini character sheet) and it has that same star.

    When you click the "x" you are removing that from the creature's active effects.

    See an earlier response:
    Start of next turn = 1 round and approve effect/ability on character's turn.
    End of next turn = 1 round and approve effect/ability after character's turn.
    - - - Note: rounds are determined from when the effect is applied. This is more of a D&D3.x/PFRPG reference.

    To get the description captured, I opened the creature's character sheet, opened the Ability Tab, and edited the Ability.
    [​IMG]
    [​IMG]
    [​IMG]
     
  8. PenCapChew

    PenCapChew New Member

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    I am using version 3.3.1 of the software. I managed to create a map marker, but I didn't have any pointers like you did, only arrows ( I used a cyan arrow). The player's were able to create an exact cyan arrow one but were not able to move it on the map since I didn't see an option to change ownership like you can with creatures/PC's. I am still not sure what it means in game terms such as data entry in the effect box for special affects in the part of the post where you stated:
    Start of next turn = 1 round and approve effect/ability on character's turn.
    End of next turn = 1 round and approve effect/ability after character's turn.

    How do I manage to do that in game terms? The save/load functions of the edit effect box are confusing to me as well. It's like the effects disappear or keep having the same name of the first effect I saved. I have followed the screenshots exactly. I have gotten to the portion of: Player ends their turn. (Player can press the spacebar or use the "End turn" button.) I hit spacebar. Judge approves effect after player ends their turn. This will allow the effect to stay until the end of Akashik's next turn. I have never seen the Decision Apply judge effect after ending the turn. I have tried involving other people to help and we still can't get it to mimic your example. I don't understand what is going wrong.

    Lastly my reference to saving throws was in regards to the wizards Sleep spell. If the target falls asleep it must roll saving throws to wake up (save ends). This is a perfect example of an effect in a spell that doesn't use damage, yet I cannot seem to create this in my game. (I have read this many times and still can't get it to work properly: http://www.d20pro.com/help/UGGMActiveEffects.php)
     
  9. edwardcd

    edwardcd Administrator
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    The image resources are included in v3.3.2 when you install the base rulesets, they are also on the marketplace if you want to get the most up-to-date ruleset you can download a copy for free from the marketplace. The pointers were the most recent addition not too long ago.

    Whoever creates the Map Marker has ownership. Only those who created the Map Marker can control it / move it / delete it. Though, the Judge can control all. So, the player must be in Map Marker mode to move the marker or edit the marker that they have created.

    If you want the effect to end on the start of that creature's next turn, make the duration of the effect 1 round and approve the effect while that creature has initiative.
    If you want the effect to end on the end of that creature's next turn, make the duration of the effect 1 round and approve the effect directly after that creature has ended their turn.

    If you are requesting something different, please rephrase your question.

    Do not worry about this. This is a legacy interface. It does appear at first glance that that the tile of your effect is the one listed in the save/load box, but it is not. It is simply the first in the list of saved effects. I completely ignore it. Unless you want to save what you have done in the effects library for your personal use (if so, you can load the effect quicker when applying an effect to a creature using keyboard commands or via the spell system).

    What happened is you already approved the effect before the end of the turn - which is why you did not see it after. For example:
    [​IMG]
    I keep the Decision Window open on this screen on the Judge side until after the player ends turn (I even have a reminder there "GM approve after turn.").

    How do you make saving throws? You roll a d20 and add what exactly? What number are you trying to beat to have a success? Please remember, while I have read the rules to D&D 4e, I read it back in 2008. If it's a simple dice roll the player can use the core dice, say they are rolling vs the sleep effect, click the d20 icon, and if it passes just remove the effect from that player's creature (or you roll the dice and either remove the effect/status icon/text or keep it).

    To properly document the effect on the creature, have you thought about applying a status icon on the creature? Or how about typing a label on the creature to say "sleeping" or "slowed" or any other description? Remember, there are multiple ways to keep track of things in d20Pro - use the one that makes your Judge/GM/DM life easier. In this example a challenge is indicated and a stunned condition is noted also.
    [​IMG]
     
  10. PenCapChew

    PenCapChew New Member

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    Thanks again for your informative pictures. I am understanding spell effects a little better. I also updated to 3.3.2 version. Some issues I have noticed:

    1) I can't seem to get attacks to cause zero damage. Whether I set the damage die to 0d1 or 1d0 my cleric cause fear spell always causes 1 radiant damage. I have even tried using a big negative number for the damage modifier but it doesn't work either.

    2) I can get melee attacks to crit (max damage) but not spell attacks. I do have crit set to max and it only works for melee attacks.

    3) I took your suggestion about editing a creature's token by going to edit, description, custom for top or bottom of label. This can help me remember if a creature has a bonus/penalty or include a status effect not listing in the program. Is there a keyboard shortcut to do this to save some time? Update: I found out its page up/page down.

    4) Is there a way to make custom status effects? I'd like to have an icon for "combat advantage". If not, I know I can label the token as described in question 3. A similar issue is the cleric's spell Lance of Faith. Not only does it do damage, it allows you to give a ally you can see a +2 bonus to hit. I tried editing for +2 to hit, duration 1, and rounds selected. It doesn't seem to apply the bonus. What are the differences between round, infinite, and instant?
     
  11. Wesley Gorby

    Wesley Gorby Production/Community Manager
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    yes, in the manually specified folder of your campaign is a zip file titled status.zip.. inside are the status icons.. you can, change any you like.. the status name is derived from the icon file name...
     

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